A reader recently wrote in to ask my opinion about dual enrollment courses. She wanted to compare them to the Advanced Placement (or AP) options at her son’s school. The question came from a post I wrote analyzing the worth of AP courses. Since she is not the only one to pose the question, let’s dive into the particulars of these two programs and compare them as best we can–with an eye to their relative importance in college admissions.

What Is Dual Enrollment?

First, a brief word of explanation about “dual enrollment,” or “post-secondary enrollment options.” Virtually all states allow high school students to enroll in community college or university courses. These courses also apply the credits earned to their high school transcript. Students enroll twice: they earn both high school AND college credits for the same course. In some cases, community college faculty offer these courses in high school, while in other cases, the high school student must travel to the community college campus. 

In other cases, community college faculty “approve” or certify high school faculty to offer a college-level course after the college has approved the syllabus. 

In most cases, parents pay an extra fee for a dual enrollment course. However, the good thing is that this fee translates to college credits that can often (but not always) be transferred to a university when the student graduates from high school (more on that in a moment). 

No matter how these dual enrollment courses are organized, dually enrolled students receive two sorts of credit for their work. They receive grades on their high school transcript, and the same grades are recorded on their college transcripts. 

Two birds, one stone.

Advantages of Dual Enrollment

The advantages of dual enrollment courses include:

• High schools can offer honors-level courses without hiring new staff
• Districts can save money by partnering with community colleges
• Parents can save on college tuition because these college credits are transferable to most state universities
• Students demonstrate that they can handle college-level work
• Students who doubt their own abilities to succeed in college experience success and are more likely to apply to college–and eventually graduate
• Community colleges and 4-year institutions build a pipeline of students moving from high school to college
• State governments and local governments appreciate the collaboration between K-12 and higher education

In states where dual enrollment options exist, the state government creates master articulation agreements to ensure that credits earned while in high school are guaranteed transfer to higher education systems in that state. Thus, if you take a dual enrollment course in Virginia, your credits are automatically accepted for credit by state-funded universities in Virginia–as long as the grade earned is a C- or above, and as long as the courses are considered academic, “general education” course (as opposed to remedial or developmental courses, or technical or industrial skills courses).

To restate, credits for dual enrollment courses taken in high school will automatically–guaranteed–transfer to universities in the same state. As long as the student performs adequately in the dual enrollment course, they will receive college credit.  The biggest advantage here is cost savings:  those are courses the student (and family) will not have to pay for on the way to a college degree.

Are Dual Enrollment Credits Transferable In-State?

To restate, credits for dual enrollment courses taken in high school will automatically–guaranteed–transfer to universities in the same state. As long as students perform adequately in the dual enrollment course, they will receive college credit.  The biggest advantage here is cost savings:  those are courses the student (and family) will not have to pay for on the way to a college degree. A dual credit history course taken at a high school in Virginia is the functional and administrative equivalent of a history course at the University of Virginia.

Are Dual Enrollment Credits Transferable Out-of-State?

With regard to whether dual enrollment credits are accepted by universities in other states, the landscape becomes a bit more random. Many publicly-funded state colleges and universities will likely accept dual enrollment credits from another state as long as the credits are listed on a transcript from an accredited community college or university. Universities in Colorado, therefore, will accept credits from Florida, as long as they are academic in nature and the student has earned a grade of C- or above. 

However, a receiving university (in the above example, the University of Colorado) would review exactly which courses would be transferred and how they would be counted towards the CU degree only after the student has applied and been accepted to CU.  Most universities operate in this way:  they tell you that “generally speaking,” courses are easily transferred, but they don’t give any specifics until after you are enrolled and they make a detailed determination of how the credits will be applied to your Bachelors degree.

Part of the reason for this is that dual enrollment credits may be counted differently depending on the major you pursue. For example, your dual enrollment college algebra course might not count toward your math requirements for an engineering degree, though it might count as an elective if you are an art history major. 

Nevertheless, it almost always benefits a student to collect dual enrollment credits as a way to reduce the cost of college and, potentially, decrease the time to the degree. If, for example, all the courses a student takes in her junior and senior years of high school are classified as dual enrollment, then effectively that student conceivably could enter as a first semester JUNIOR in college (depending on where the credits are and how they conform to the university’s graduation and major requirements). 

Readers should be aware, therefore, that different states have different rules about how they handle dual enrollment credits from out-of-state students. Do not assume that every dual enrollment credit will be automatically transferred. As with everything in the world of college admissions, you need to do the research to find the answers you need. Policies like this shift all the time, and you need to verify what your desired universities will do with those dual enrollment credits.

Do Dual Enrollment Credits Transfer to Private Universities?

Private colleges are a different matter, however. As private entities, they are free to establish their own transfer criteria. Here again, it is best to check in advance of applying what the college’s policy toward dual enrollment credits will be. Some will be happy to transfer the courses in, as long as their college offers an equivalent course. Others may require a grade of B or better to transfer. And some may not transfer any of your dual enrollment courses at all. Some of the more selective colleges may use dual enrollment credits only to waive prerequisites or for placement purposes.

One thing is clear, however: colleges and universities of all types smile upon applicants who have completed dual enrollment courses. These courses demonstrate the ability to do college-level work, and they send the signal to admissions offices that this student is likely to succeed in college–because they have been challenged in college-level curricula.

Which is Better, AP, IB or DE? 

The answer is: it depends.

First, some schools are unable to offer both AP and dual enrollment courses. In fact, rural high schools are much more likely to rely on dual enrollment courses than AP, because dual enrollment is less expensive to the school district–especially if there is not enough demand to fill a complete AP course. And IB programs are rare because this program is both expensive and affects the entire curriculum offerings at a school that adopts the program. So if there is no AP or IB option in your school, you should definitely consider dual enrollment options. (If you want to dig into whether you should select an AP or IB curriculum, check out this post that compares the IB and AP programs.)

Second, if your goal is to reduce the costs of attending a state university, dual enrollment credits are a guaranteed discount. Because states automatically require these courses to transfer, any PSEO course you take will reduce the number of credits you must complete (and pay for!) while in college. As long you dually enroll in a college prep course and you get a C- or better, you get the college credit.

The AP tests and the IB diploma program, by contrast, come with high-stakes tests:  take the course and then take the test. If you pass an AP test with a score of 3, 4, or 5, you might get college credit. The amount of credit would depend on the policy in place at a particular college or university.  But note that your grade in the AP course has no bearing on whether you get college credit.  The credit you receive depends on your score on the exam.  Thus you could get an A+ in your AP US History class, but get a 2 on the test–in which was you would receive no credit anywhere (well, you’d get the high school credit that leads to your high school diploma, but it would not give you any benefit once you arrive at college). 

The Benefit of Standardized Testing

The AP tests and the IB exams are standardized. They are normed tests. Thus, presumably, a score of 5 on the AP Chemistry means the same thing, no matter whether student attended a private school in Connecticut, a rural public school in Alabama, or an international school in Uruguay.  Similarly, a perfect 7 on the IB English A exam would be considered the same no matter where in the world the student attended secondary school. 

By contrast, an A in that dual enrollment chemistry class might or might not be the educational equivalent of a chemistry class in another location. Some high schools have higher standards than others, some community colleges have higher standards than others, and some individual teachers have higher standards than others (a fact that every high school student everywhere understands). Dual enrollment courses are not standardized. There is no “norm.” An A in one place could be different from an A in another.  

Thus, highly selective universities in the United States tend to favor AP and IB exam results over dual enrollment credits.  Not only are the highly selective less likely to grant you the credits you receive in dual enrollment courses, they are more likely to discount the value of those courses, especially if you had the opportunity to take those rigorous AP or IB courses in your school or community. 

Third, if your school has a strong AP program that has a history of success in helping students earn 4s and 5s on the AP test, you might want to consider the AP courses if you plan to attend a highly selective college or university. The reason is this: the AP test is a demonstration of proficiency and competence in a subject matter.

While credit is a demonstration that you did what the teacher or professor required of you, the AP test is a nationally-normed test (and the IB is globally-normed). A score of 5 on an AP test communicates that are you a good student who can handle college-level work, that you are capable of performing well on cumulative examinations, and that you have demonstrated a high degree of mastery of the subject matter. This is why selective colleges and universities strongly prefer AP and IB results over grades in dual enrollment courses.

So Should You Take Dual Enrollment or AP Classes?

Again, it depends. Remember that not every student has a choice, as not every school offers AP courses while most public high schools are able to offer dual enrollment options. 

If your goal is to reduce the cost of your college education and you plan to go to a public university in-state, there is no doubt that dual enrollment options are going to save you money and reduce the time necessary to earn your college degree. For the vast majority of Americans, the dual enrollment option is the smartest choice.  No high stakes exams.  No doubts as to the ability to transfer credits to college. Take those dual enrollment courses, get good grades, and get through college more quickly and more cheaply.

If your goal is to attend one of the most selective colleges and universities in the United States–and your high school offers them–then take the AP or IB courses on offer.  They are considered by admissions offers at these universities to be more rigorous, and the cumulative examinations at the end of the course demonstrate clearly how you stack up against other students taking the same subject across the country (or across the world). 

The Caveat:  Your High School’s Pass Rate on the AP Exams

Standardized tests, despite their flaws, do help admissions officers compare apples to apples. They help to separate grades from proficiency.  High scores provide external verification that the grades a student earns are an expression of content mastery. 

However, as we have noted, not all teachers are the same. The AP curriculum is challenging and rigorous. Not every teacher is either trained or experienced in delivering this curriculum. For example, there is a low-performing high school in my community where nearly 80% of the teachers are first-year teachers–every year! AP courses at this school are being taught be very, very inexperienced teachers. 

Therefore if you are considering AP courses offered at your school, ask questions and do some investigating. Some schools have very low pass rates on the AP exams. Even students who get high grades in their AP courses core only 1 or 2 on the exams. (In other words, these students fail and will absolutely not receive any college credit, nor will they be able to brag about their high scores on their college applications). 

Just because a course is labeled AP does not mean that it is a good course. Nor does the label mean that a student will achieve the level of mastery required to score a 5 on the AP exam. Many, many schools across the country offer AP courses that are very poorly taught. Many teachers simply do not have the content background or pedagogical skills to prepare students for these rigorous exams.

The College Board is trying to ratchet up the standards. They know that parents are noticing the disconnect between the brand name and teacher preparedness. Efforts by the College Board to verify AP syllabi in all courses labeled AP is a good start. But in the end, success in the AP (or IB) program is not about the curriculum alone. It is about the teacher who delivers that curriculum.

As a quick aside, huge variances between classroom grades and results on the IB exams are less common–though they do happen. The most important reason for this is that schools that adopt the IB program pay very high fees to participate in the program, the syllabi are much more standardized, and the International Baccalaureate Organization requires schools to train their teachers in the delivery of these syllabi. Schools that have been offering the IB curriculum for many years are generally pretty good at delivering the program and helping students to achieve good results. Nevertheless, it is important for students and parents to inquire about a secondary school’s IB pass rates before enrolling in the program.

Jaime Escalante of Stand and Deliver fame enabled his poor, inner-city students to pass the AP calculus exam. He was a fantastic, talented, workaholic teacher who did not rest until his students passed that exam. Teachers in your school’s AP program may resemble Mr. Escalante.  Or they may resemble Mr. Larson. He was my high school math teacher. He was as creative as a lima bean and as dedicated as an assembly line worker two weeks before retirement. An AP syllabus in his hands would make it highly unlikely that anyone but Einstein himself would pass that AP Calculus exam.

A Student Vouches for the Value of Dual Enrollment Courses

Over the years, students have read my blog and written to me to share their own experiences and insights. A young woman who attended the College of William and Mary read this post a while back and took the time to write to me to advocate for dual enrollment courses. She attended a high school in Virginia and then enrolled at the selective, public liberal arts college in that state. I think it’s worth quoting this letter in full, because it speaks to the priorities and choices students face as they choose the right path for themselves. There is no right and wrong answer to the question, “which is better, AP or dual enrollment classes?”.  Each student and family must make decide what makes the most sense given their values, priorities, and preferences. 

So thank you, Sarah, for writing in with your opinion, and I’m happy to share it below.

Mark Montgomery
College Counselor
Great College Advice

Mark,

As a current college student, I vouch for the dual enrollment option when high school students are looking through their course options. I went to a very small, rural high school in Virginia, and had the opportunity to take DE credit classes through local community colleges. I finished at the top of my class and I am currently an academic junior at the College of William and Mary.

During my freshman year in college, I came to find that a majority of my friends took AP classes, got an A or a high B in the class, but couldn’t get a 4 or 5 on their AP exam (mind you, these students came from great private and public high schools all over the country, each with its own long-standing AP track). William and Mary requires a score of 4 or 5 to get credit from an AP course. I can’t tell you how many of my friends got burned by taking AP. All 39 of my dual enrollment credits transferred and I am graduating in 3 years.

A lot of really great colleges and universities require high AP scores. So it is very important to do your research on the school you wish to attend. Taking an AP class may look good on a transcript. But how good will it look when the student doesn’t pass the exam with the necessary score? I feel like AP is put up on this pedestal as being the best of the best. However, there is nothing wrong with dual enrollment classes, and taking DE doesn’t mean that one could not handle the supposed “harder” AP course load. I can assure you, the classes I took through my governor’s school were more than challenging.

Best of luck,

Sarah

The post AP, IB, and Dual Enrollment: Which Is Better for College Admission first appeared on College Admission Counseling.

As the Munchkins of Oz might have sung, “Ding Dong, The Wicked Subject Tests are Dead!”

But, as with the death of any reviled demon, the question remains, “what’s next”?

What will this mean for competitive students?  What will it mean for the elite colleges that have required them?  What will it mean for the College Board, the creators of the now-defunct demon?

It’s hard to predict every ramification of this change in the college admissions landscape.  However, tapping into the collective experience and expertise of the team at Great College Advice, we have come up with a list of “Good News and Bad News” to anticipate what is next.

We’d like to hope that College Admissions Land will become a more peaceful and tranquil place, now that the subject tests are gone.

And yet experience tells us there are unseen forces at work that could raise the specter of other, lesser demons that may gain more power and rise to terrorize aspirants to top colleges and universities.

So let’s have a peek.  Maybe things will get better.  Or maybe they won’t.  Either way, perhaps we can be prepared for whatever the future slings at us.

GOOD: Less stress for applicants (and their parents)

It’s wonderful that students will have one less standardized test to take in the college admissions process.  The respite from spending time strategizing which tests to take, preparing for those exams, and losing yet another Saturday morning worshipping the false idol that is the College Board will bring a great sigh of relief to students, parents, and college counselors everywhere.

GOOD: Less money spent on tutors for the SAT2 Subject Tests

The process of preparing and applying to college can be expensive, and the SAT Subject Tests have been one of the streams of cash leaving the pockets of parents and stuffing the pockets of the College Board.

GOOD: More colleges may become entirely test optional

Approximately 550 colleges and universities dropped testing requirements during the coronavirus pandemic.  About 1100 colleges and universities already were test optional.  As the testing organizations scrambled, some colleges have been learning how to evaluate applications without test scores, and we predict that at least half—perhaps more—of the newly test optional schools will remain test optional permanently.

GOOD: School counselors will not have to administer SAT2 Subject Tests on behalf of the College Board ever again

School counselors everywhere will celebrate that they no longer must give up their own Saturdays to proctor these tests.  However, these celebrations will be brief, as the same school counselors will still have to administer the “regular” SAT and ACT for a long time to come.

BAD: One fewer objective measure in the admissions process

While the SAT Subject Tests had dubious value in measuring the content knowledge of college applicants, they constituted one objective measure in the admissions process.  Test takers received a score.  A number.  Something that could be compared from one student to the next.  Never mind that the comparison didn’t really tell us much.  At least it was an objective indicator of something… something that admissions officers could use to separate the “good” applicants from the “bad” ones.

No one is happier to see these tests go than I, but their disappearance just makes the whole admissions process more subjective.  Colleges call this subjectivity “a holistic review,” which sounds much more humane.  Yet, whether you call it “subjective” or “holistic,” the process has very few objective guideposts—which leaves everyone scrambling to divine what it is colleges are really looking for.  When colleges say, “we look at it all,” what does that really mean?  How does a young person prepare for a holistic or subjective (or just plain opaque) review process?

BAD: Increased importance of the SAT and ACT tests themselves

With the extinction of SAT Subject Tests, the SAT and ACT will become even more important, especially for highly selective private universities and for flagship state universities.  Because GPAs are not consistent from district to district and school to school, and because curriculum offerings can also vary widely, using measures of “academic performance” and “academic rigor” remain pretty darned subjective.  It’s hard to compare apples to oranges.  So standardized tests are a handy (if imperfect) means to compare students in wildly divergent scholastic circumstances.

This is actually why the SAT (and then later, the ACT) were developed:  to give college admissions offices a tool to compare students against a norm of some kind.  Again, the tests are deeply flawed mechanisms to do so.  But since the United States has no nation-wide secondary school exit exam (as they do in almost every other country in the world), the colleges themselves had to invent something to help them at least attempt to level the playing field.  So don’t expect the SAT or ACT to go away.  Expect them to retain their place in college admissions, especially for state universities and elite private institutions.

GOOD: Less revenue to the College Board Death Star

The College Board bills itself as a public entity, preparing young people for higher education.  Whatever the mission printed on the website, or whether it uses a “.org” URL, or however the organization is legally constituted, the fact is that the College Board (like the ACT) is a business. Its not-for-profit tax status does not change its behavior:  the College Board is a rent-seeking organization propelled by capitalistic incentives.

The College Board made a business decision to eliminate the Subject Tests.  Fewer and fewer universities have been requiring them, and even some of the Ivies abandoned them in the past few years.  The profit margin on these tests became so small that it squeezed them out of existence.  In the absence of adequate demand, the College Board simply eliminated a product line.  It happens all the time in business (anyone want to buy my old Sony Walkman Betamax…please?).

Rest assured, the College Board itself is not going out of business:  the Death Star still shines.  The SAT is as healthy as ever, and it will be undergoing some new updates soon, including the long-awaited roll-out of its online version.  The College Board wants consumers and colleges to depend on them for making the admissions process both manageable and valuable, so they will do what they can to continue innovating, growing, and expanding—just as we would expect of any healthy business.

RIP, Subject Tests.  But Long Live the College Board!

BAD: Possible increase in importance of the AP tests (the Death Star pulls out its other weapon)

As the College Board kills one product line, we anticipate that it will focus on the strength of its other tried-and-true products.  In addition to its flagship exam, the Advanced Placement program is a wildly successful revenue stream.

The AP program takes advantage of one of the other peculiar features of the US educational system:  we have no common national curriculum.  Since we cannot compare students’ performance from state to state, district to district, and school to school because of the decentralized nature of our educational system, the private sector has stepped in to supply what the government has not:  a national, college preparatory curriculum.  The AP delivers the syllabi to schools and requires parents to pick up the tab for the examinations at nearly $100 a pop.

To reiterate, since the federal government does not develop and maintain a national curriculum, the incentives of capitalism do it for us.  In 2019, the College Board administered nearly 5.1 million Advanced Placement exams—up from 1.4 million in 2000.  That rate of increase would make any CEO swell with pride.  And this meteoric growth of the AP has helped swell the College Board’s cash reserves, which were estimated at $1.15 billion in 2018.

BAD: More high schools may feel compelled to offer Advanced Placement courses

High schools base their own success on two metrics:  the percentage of students who graduate with a high school diploma, and the percentage of students who go on to college.  Many will also tout the colleges and universities to which their students have been accepted (often you’ll see the roster of college acceptances on the high school’s website).

If high schools want to make their students competitive, then more may feel compelled to adopt the curriculum and administer the exams.

However, not every school will have the resources to be able to implement the Advanced Placement program.  Rural schools, in particular, may be unable to do so—they’re having enough trouble gassing up their buses, paying competitive salaries for highly qualified teachers, fixing the leaky roof, and paying the electric bill.  And some of the fancy private day and boarding schools will not need or want to offer the AP curriculum, preferring to offer their own boutique courses, such as “Gender and Power in Tudor England” (Philips Andover) or “Biological Oceanography” (The Cate School).

BAD: More students may feel compelled to self-study for the AP exams

Self-study!  Students can prep for the exams themselves, even if their schools do not offer these courses.  They can perhaps complete a dual enrollment course at their local community college or nearby university, and then take the AP exam.  They can hire a tutor to prep them for the course, and then pay for that AP exam.  Or they can just access free or low-cost materials to help themselves prepare.

My students from China do this all the time.  Kids in International Baccalaureate programs sometimes add Advanced Placement exams to their already full plate. And even kids who attend elite boarding schools like Philips Andover (including ones I have advised) will self-study for AP exams, even though their teachers and administrators, and even yours truly, beg them not to. (Incidentally, my student who did self-study for 3 AP exams, aced all three and was admitted to Harvard…so apparently the strategy works.)

The fact is that the demand for AP exams will continue to rise.  While the Subject Tests have gone the way of New Coke, the Edsel, and Pan Am Airways, the College Board’s Advanced Placement program is more like Amazon Prime.  If you could purchase stock shares in the College Board, I’d rate them a “buy.”

GOOD: Continued competition between the College Board and ACT on their signature tests

Capitalism creates and thrives on competition.  It is healthy.  It fuels innovation.  Fortunately, competition is alive and well in the college preparatory standardized test space.  The ACT and SAT are fighting tooth and nail for market share.  And in some ways, the elimination of the Subject Tests is part of the cycle of capitalistic decay and renewal.  ACT introduced the first online version of its signature test.  The SAT is moving to roll out its own online version (after an aborted attempt about a year ago).  Each company continues to tweak its test, presumably to make it a better measure of college readiness.

Whether or not these tweaks really are innovations, we can count on both organizations to serve their various clientele:  the colleges, the states that require their use as part of what used to be called “No Child Left Behind,” the schools that use their curricula, and the parents who pay for the exams.  Students, however, have little say in the matter.  Cogs in the machine.  Bricks in the wall.

Kind of depressing, actually.

But perhaps there is one bright spot, albeit a brief one:  Kids, you have one less set of exams to worry about.  Enjoy the feeling for as long as it lasts.

The post The Demise of the SAT2 Subject Tests: Good News or Bad News for College Admission? first appeared on College Admission Counseling.

AP courses are not as rigorous as college courses. 

Many college professors have asserted that the AP courses in their subjects aren’t nearly as challenging as the “equivalent” college courses. Therefore, students who earn AP scores that enable them to skip an introductory college course and enroll in a more advanced course may struggle compared to students who took the introductory course at the college level.

AP classes are not taught on the same timeline as college classes. 

Most AP classes are taught over the course of an entire school year. Whereas, in college, a course might last anywhere from 3 1/2 weeks (at a college with a block plan) to 16 weeks (at a college with two semesters). Thus, in a college course, students have far less time to learn the material than in an AP course. Both this argument and the previous one seem to negate the idea that AP courses truly help students develop the skills needed for success in college.

AP courses might not save you money. 

More and more colleges are refusing to give students credit for AP exams. For example, Dartmouth College recently announced that, beginning with the class of 2018, it will not award any AP credits. Dartmouth stated that its decision was due to the fact that AP courses aren’t as demanding as college courses, and it cited a study the college conducted as evidence of this. (For more on Dartmouth’s study, see this New York Times article.) 

While Dartmouth’s reasoning appears to be in the best interest of students. It also seems likely that colleges are making it more difficult to earn AP credits because of financial reasons. After all, if a student doesn’t have to take and pay for a college class, the college loses money!

AP classes place undue stress on students. 

In some schools, it’s not unusual for students to take four or five AP classes in a single year. AP exams are given in May, and many students also take the ACT, SAT, and/or SAT Subject Tests in the spring of junior year. This means that for several months, these students’ lives will revolve around studying for one test or another. That doesn’t leave much time for homework, extracurricular activities, a job, or fun and free time. In response to this problem, some schools have begun limiting the number of AP classes students can take. Other schools have gone so far as to eliminate the classes altogether and to offer advanced-level, teacher-designed courses instead.

AP courses are too broad and inflexible.

Many critics of the AP program argue that the courses try to cover so much material that they aren’t able to examine any of it in-depth. Additionally, because AP teachers have to follow a lengthy and detailed curriculum. This leaves little room for flexibility or creativity on the part of the teacher or the students.

AP courses no longer stand out on college applications.

Some students think that taking AP classes, especially in large quantities, will give them an edge in the college admissions process. The fact is that these days, so many students take AP classes that having them on your transcript doesn’t really mean much to college admissions officers. 

In 1955-56, the first school year in which AP courses were offered, only 1,229 students took these classes. But in the 2010-2011 school year, approximately two million students — or one-third of all U.S. high school students — took AP courses. Colleges always want to see that you’ve challenged yourself by taking the most advanced courses your school offers. My point is simply that having AP on your transcript isn’t the attention-grabber it once was.

As you can see, there are more arguments against taking AP classes than in favor of taking them. Yet, millions of students take them every year, so they can’t be all bad. Ultimately, you’ll have to weigh the pros and cons and decide what’s best for you. Good luck!

The post Should You Take AP Classes? Part 2 first appeared on College Admission Counseling.

Pros of taking AP classes:

AP courses can help students develop the skills needed to succeed in college. 

The rigors of AP classes are designed to be very similar to those of college courses. So AP helps students prepare for the demands of college by teaching them study, organizational, and time management skills.

AP classes lead to better outcomes in college. 

Students who take AP classes and pass AP exams go to college at higher rates. Get better grades in college, and are more likely to graduate from college in four years. Students who score a 3 or higher on an AP exam are three times more likely to earn a college degree than students who score below a 3. African American and Hispanic students who earn a 3 or higher are four times more likely to earn a college degree. Even students who score a 2 on AP exams are more likely to graduate than students who don’t take the exams.

AP courses are sometimes better than college courses.

A 2007 study found that students who earned at least a 3 on AP exams in most subjects get higher grades in the next-level college course than students who took the college’s own introductory course. This study examined data from colleges across the country, including 27 highly selective schools.

AP classes can earn students college credits. 

Students who receive a high enough score on an AP exam may be given college credits and/or be able to “opt out” of an introductory college course and take a more advanced course. The required score depends on the college, but no college accepts less than a 3. Students who earn a large number of AP credits may even be able to finish college early. A friend of mine graduated in three years because she had so many AP credits!

AP classes are much cheaper than college classes.

The cost for an AP exam this year is $89. That’s far less than you’ll pay for a college course, even at the least expensive college. And if you’re able to graduate a semester or year early, you/your parents will save big time!

Stay tuned for another blog post that examines the cons of taking AP courses.

The post Should You Take AP Classes? Part 1 first appeared on College Admission Counseling.

The post Choosing a High School or School District To Boost College Admission Chances first appeared on College Admission Counseling.

Here’s what she said:

Mark,

As a current college student, I vouch for the dual enrollment option when high school students are looking through their course options. I went to a very small, rural high school in Virginia, and had the opportunity to take DE credit classes through local community colleges. I finished at the top of my class and I am currently an academic junior at the College of William and Mary.

During my freshman year in college, I came to find that a majority of my friends took AP classes, got an A or a high B in the class. But couldn’t get a 4 or 5 on their AP exam (mind you, these students came from great private and public high schools all over the country, each with its own long standing AP track). William and Mary require a score of 4 or 5 to get credit from an AP course. I can’t tell you how many of my friends got burned by taking AP. All 39 of my dual enrollment credits transferred and I am graduating in 3 years.

A lot of really great colleges and universities require high AP scores. So it is very important to do your research on the school you wish to attend. Taking an AP class may look good on a transcript. But how good will it look when the student doesn’t pass the exam with the necessary score? I feel like AP is put up on this pedestal as being the best of the best. However, there is nothing wrong with dual enrollment classes, and taking DE doesn’t mean that one could not handle the supposed “harder” AP course load. I can assure you, the classes I took through my governor’s school were more than challenging.

Best of luck,

Sarah

So you heard it here first: if you want to prepare for a good college and save lots of money. Give serious consideration to the dual enrollment options at your local community college. You may thank me later!

Mark Montgomery
Educational Consultant

The post The Value of Dual Enrollment Courses–A Student at William and Mary Chimes In first appeared on College Admission Counseling.

The post New Advanced Placement (AP) Tests on the Horizon from College Board first appeared on College Admission Counseling.

Conventional wisdom holds that AP courses are excellent preparation for college. They are considered to be rigorous. The general idea is that they are the equivalent of college-level, introductory survey courses, and often colleges will offer credit or advanced standing for those who perform well in them. And in many respects this is all true. But it’s also true that not all students should take loads of AP courses, and in some contexts, an AP courses may not be all that rigorous or helpful preparation for college. Like everything in the college admissions process, there are no black and white truths. Every decision a student makes has to be taken within the student’s own context.

Let’s look at the value of the AP program and the reasons for its rapid adoption across the United States. Later we’ll look at some of the downsides of the program, as well as some of the other options that students might to consider instead of the AP program.

AP courses are a de facto national college prep curriculum

Globally, the United States is unlike any other when it comes to public education. We have no national curriculum. The authority for education is left to the 50 states and, more unusually, to the 14,000 some odd school districts.  These districts set policies, establish curriculum, and provide the majority of funding for local public schools. This is what we call “local control” of our schools. Whatever one’s thoughts on the wisdom of this arrangement (and believe me, I have a lot of thoughts), the fact is that each district is allowed to set its own curriculum, its own standards, and its own educational policies.

The result is that these 14,000 districts and 50 states don’t agree on much (it turns out that letting legislatures and politicians decide what should be taught–or not taught–in our schools becomes a political feeding frenzy). There is no national curriculum. There are no national benchmarks for what students are supposed to learn. There is no standard for what students must know and be able to do to pass an an individual class, or even to graduation from high school.

This makes it difficult for colleges and universities to compare one student with another. Since no two students may follow the same curriculum or be assumed to acquire the same knowledge, colleges must come up with their own flexible, subjective (universities use the nicer, more positive term of “holistic”) system for evaluating candidates with wildly different credentials.

Enter the College Board with its structured curricula and college-level examinations to fill the void.  Since our state and national governments cannot agree on a national curriculum, private enterprise has created one for us.

Today, the College Board offers this “national curriculum” in every major subject area taught in US high schools. It offers courses in English (2), math (6), history and the social sciences (9), natural science (7, including 4 different courses in physics), the arts (6), and a capstone program with its seminar and research courses. Other courses are being developed and introduced, including one on African-American history that has caused some political controversy.

AP tests are good college admission–if you have a high score

The value of the AP tests is quite clear. The AP tests are normed.  In other words, the score that one student gets in one place is considered to have performed to the same standards. The AP tests (as well as the SAT and ACT) are the very definition of “standardized tests”.

In the the holistic (or subjective) realm of college admissions, these tests provide some sort of way to compare students across the country and across the world.  Thus, those students with scores of 5 on the AP US History test will be judged to have masters the content from the AP US History curriculum, while those who score a 2 or 1 on the same test will be judged to have failed to masted that content. In that way, the high performing students will be considered more desirable by admissions officers.

AP courses in college admission

The syllabi for the AP program’s many course offerings are available for free for anyone who wants them. The College Board wants these courses to be accessible to all (the College Board makes its money by charging for the exams, not by the distribution of the curriculum or syllabi).

The good thing about these courses is that they are relatively rigorous.  The syllabi make clear what should be taught (and learned) in the courses, and the content of the exams consistently mirrors what is supposed to be taught (and learned) in the classroom.

The Advanced Placement program, created by the College Board, does have its critics who decry the amount of rote memorization or brute calculation that the exams tend to emphasize. I do not necessarily disagree with these critiques. For today’s purposes, however, I’m going to set aside these criticisms. Generally speaking, the transparency of the curricula demonstrate that the courses expect a fairly high level of intellectual engagement.

This is why many, many colleges and universities across the country offer “advanced placement” credits for students who perform well on the exams. Universities consider AP courses to be “college level” and therefore reward students to take them by offering credits toward their college diplomas.

The problem is that while the exams are consistent from one place to another, the courses themselves are not. In some places, the teachers are unprepared to teach the rigorous content of the AP courses.  For example, at an poorly-resourced urban school in the Denver area, nearly 75% of the teachers–every year–are first year teachers.  These freshly minted teachers are barely older than the high school students themselves, and may not have the content knowledge themselves to teach these rigorous courses, and they are unlikely to have any specialized training in delivering AP curricula or preparing students for the examinations.

In other wealthy, suburban locations like Lexington, Massachusetts, or Boulder, Colorado, teachers are generally more senior, more highly paid, and better prepared with advanced degrees in their content areas. These teachers also have access to professional development funds to help them learn how to deliver the AP curriculum and help kids cram for the tests.

“Access” to AP courses does not mean that the AP courses are good for college admission

Statistics from North Carolina further illustrate the disconnect between the AP courses and success on the AP tests.  North Carolina loves the AP program. In fact, the state pays for the administration of AP tests so that all students in North Carolina have access to a rigorous curriculum. But access, by itself, does not create a pathway to success. Even though North Carolina’s AP pass rate has increased over the past five years to 59.2% in 2022, it is still no better than the national pass rate of 60.2%.

Think about that for a second.

Nationwide, fully 40% of the students who attempt an AP exam fail it, even though–presumably–the students taking the class are prepared for a a college preparatory curriculum.

It’s great that more and more kids have access to rigorous AP courses, and certainly would not want to deny any child who wanted to challenge herself to enroll in a rigorous, college-level AP course. But if she enrolls, don’t we have a responsibility to support that student so she can perform well on the test, too?

Why do so many students fail AP tests?

I work on a pro bono basis for several students at an inner-city high school in Denver. One of my students is ranked second in her class of over 500 students. Academically, she is a stand-out. She is beloved by administrators, teachers, and peers.

She has been singled out as a rare talent in a school with more than its fair share of problems. She is enrolled in AP classes. And she even got to take one during her sophomore year. She received a score of 1 out of 5 on the AP test. How did that happen?

Perhaps students at this school are simply not as bright as the students across town in the wealthy suburbs, where it’s relatively routine for students to score 4 or 5 on the same test. Perhaps this poor girl simply doesn’t have the same preparation, so there is no way she—or any of her peers at this school—could perform on the same level as her peers across the city boundary.

Or is it the teacher? Is it that the teacher of this class in this school does not have the content expertise or the teaching skills to push the students hard enough and far enough to pass the test? How many inner-city high schools are full of talented, passionate teachers like Jaime Escalante, who “stand and deliver” advanced calculus to black and brown students? (Answer: precious few: this is one of those schools in which the overwhelming majority of teachers are in their first year of teaching!)

Or, is this young girl’s failure on the AP test a symptom of something more insidious at work in our educational system? It is simply the culture of low expectations that allows us to offer a course with an AP label, and then neglect to push poorer, browner students in the same way we push their richer, whiter peers?

It’s complicated. But there is no way to escape the disconnect between providing “access” to Advanced Placement and providing the adequate resources to help students pass them. It’s great that North Carolina pays for the administration of the AP tests. But if we want to see pass rates go up, we’d have to examine how North Carolina is creating a system in which the statewide pass rates on AP exams surpass the national average.

How can you find out if Advanced Placement courses are good for college admission at your school?

Putting aside these real issues of educational equity, how can students and their families decide whether an AP course is good for college admission? But for now, I want to focus on what parents can and should be asking about their students’ AP courses.

Essentially, you need to be asking about pass rates. The fact that the AP course is not enough for it to be a “good” course. An AP course in which a high proportion of enrolled students fails the exam is not going to be good for those students when it comes time for college admission. Of course, the rigor of the AP course may be the the best way for the student to access a rigorous curriculum.

Parents should value the availability of AP courses in their schools. But parents should also be digging deeper.

Parents should be asking administrators and teachers some better, tougher questions about those AP courses.

What can I ask my school to learn if Advanced Placement courses are good for college admission?

Basically, you’re trying to find out how well your school supports the AP program and how well it prepares students enrolled in the AP program for success on the nationally-normed examinations.  Here are some questions you might ask of administrators and teachers at your high school.

1. How long has this course been taught in this school?
2. How long has this teacher been teaching this course?
3. Has the teacher received special training to teach this course? If so, what kind of training, and from whom?
4. Are students who take the course required to sit for the AP exam? If not, why not?
5. What percentage of those who take the course attempt the test?
6. What is the teacher’s pass rate? If the teacher taught the course at a different school, what was his or her pass rate there?
7. Of those who passed, how many received a 4 or 5 on the test?
8. Are the teacher’s grades for the course related, in any way, to anticipated performance on the AP test?
9. What sort of assessments does the teacher use in the course? How similar are those assessments to the actual AP tests?
10. How much is writing emphasized in this AP course? (Many of the tests require substantial writing, not just multiple choice questions.)

These sorts of questions will help you better assess the value of a particular AP course at a particular school.

If you find that the answers to these questions are unsatisfactory, there might actually be better options for your college-bound student. Perhaps one of the best is to seek out dual enrollment options at a local college or community college, where your student can take a bona fide college course—at no cost in most states—and be guaranteed of receiving college credit if the student passes the course. (Check out this post for more comparisons between the AP, IB, and dual enrollment options.)

As with most everything else in this world, you cannot judge something merely by its label. The AP brand is generally pretty good. But you’d better look carefully at your school’s ability to help students succeed in those courses before you encourage your student to sign up.

Still wondering if Advanced Placement courses are good for college admission in your particular circumstances?

The decision about whether to take AP courses–how many and which ones–is a big one for many students on the road to college admission. The professional college counselors at Great College Advice help individuals students make these decisions. We help you decide whether AP courses are going to be better for you than other options, like dual enrollment opportunities. We help you decide which AP courses would be best for you to take, and which ones you may not need. We want to help you get into college, and we also want you to take full advantage of all your educational opportunities while in high school. The AP program is a great way to challenge yourself and prepare for college. But as you enroll in those courses, you need to be sure that you have the tools to succeed–not only in the course but on those dreaded exams.  Give us a call or contact us online if you’d like to discuss your personalized plan toward college success.  We’d be happy to chat with you.

Mark Montgomery
Independent College Counseling

The post Are Advanced Placement Courses Good for College Admission first appeared on College Admission Counseling.

Conventional wisdom holds that AP courses are excellent preparation for college. They are considered to be rigorous. The general idea is that they are the equivalent of college-level, introductory survey courses, and often colleges will offer credit or advanced standing for those who perform well in them. And in many respects this is all true. But it’s also true that not all students should take loads of AP courses, and in some contexts, an AP courses may not be all that rigorous or helpful preparation for college. Like everything in the college admissions process, there are no black and white truths. Every decision a student makes has to be taken within the student’s own context.

Let’s look at the value of the AP program and the reasons for its rapid adoption across the United States. Later we’ll look at some of the downsides of the program, as well as some of the other options that students might to consider instead of the AP program.

AP courses are a de facto national college prep curriculum

Globally, the United States is unlike any other when it comes to public education. We have no national curriculum. The authority for education is left to the 50 states and, more unusually, to the 14,000 some odd school districts.  These districts set policies, establish curriculum, and provide the majority of funding for local public schools. This is what we call “local control” of our schools. Whatever one’s thoughts on the wisdom of this arrangement (and believe me, I have a lot of thoughts), the fact is that each district is allowed to set its own curriculum, its own standards, and its own educational policies.

The result is that these 14,000 districts and 50 states don’t agree on much (it turns out that letting legislatures and politicians decide what should be taught–or not taught–in our schools becomes a political feeding frenzy). There is no national curriculum. There are no national benchmarks for what students are supposed to learn. There is no standard for what students must know and be able to do to pass an an individual class, or even to graduation from high school.

This makes it difficult for colleges and universities to compare one student with another. Since no two students may follow the same curriculum or be assumed to acquire the same knowledge, colleges must come up with their own flexible, subjective (universities use the nicer, more positive term of “holistic”) system for evaluating candidates with wildly different credentials.

Enter the College Board with its structured curricula and college-level examinations to fill the void.  Since our state and national governments cannot agree on a national curriculum, private enterprise has created one for us.

Today, the College Board offers this “national curriculum” in every major subject area taught in US high schools. It offers courses in English (2), math (6), history and the social sciences (9), natural science (7, including 4 different courses in physics), the arts (6), and a capstone program with its seminar and research courses. Other courses are being developed and introduced, including one on African-American history that has caused some political controversy.

AP tests are good college admission–if you have a high score

The value of the AP tests is quite clear. The AP tests are normed.  In other words, the score that one student gets in one place is considered to have performed to the same standards. The AP tests (as well as the SAT and ACT) are the very definition of “standardized tests”.

In the the holistic (or subjective) realm of college admissions, these tests provide some sort of way to compare students across the country and across the world.  Thus, those students with scores of 5 on the AP US History test will be judged to have masters the content from the AP US History curriculum, while those who score a 2 or 1 on the same test will be judged to have failed to masted that content. In that way, the high performing students will be considered more desirable by admissions officers.

AP courses in college admission

The syllabi for the AP program’s many course offerings are available for free for anyone who wants them. The College Board wants these courses to be accessible to all (the College Board makes its money by charging for the exams, not by the distribution of the curriculum or syllabi).

The good thing about these courses is that they are relatively rigorous.  The syllabi make clear what should be taught (and learned) in the courses, and the content of the exams consistently mirrors what is supposed to be taught (and learned) in the classroom.

The Advanced Placement program, created by the College Board, does have its critics who decry the amount of rote memorization or brute calculation that the exams tend to emphasize. I do not necessarily disagree with these critiques. For today’s purposes, however, I’m going to set aside these criticisms. Generally speaking, the transparency of the curricula demonstrate that the courses expect a fairly high level of intellectual engagement.

This is why many, many colleges and universities across the country offer “advanced placement” credits for students who perform well on the exams. Universities consider AP courses to be “college level” and therefore reward students to take them by offering credits toward their college diplomas.

The problem is that while the exams are consistent from one place to another, the courses themselves are not. In some places, the teachers are unprepared to teach the rigorous content of the AP courses.  For example, at an poorly-resourced urban school in the Denver area, nearly 75% of the teachers–every year–are first year teachers.  These freshly minted teachers are barely older than the high school students themselves, and may not have the content knowledge themselves to teach these rigorous courses, and they are unlikely to have any specialized training in delivering AP curricula or preparing students for the examinations.

In other wealthy, suburban locations like Lexington, Massachusetts, or Boulder, Colorado, teachers are generally more senior, more highly paid, and better prepared with advanced degrees in their content areas. These teachers also have access to professional development funds to help them learn how to deliver the AP curriculum and help kids cram for the tests.

“Access” to AP courses does not mean that the AP courses are good for college admission

Statistics from North Carolina further illustrate the disconnect between the AP courses and success on the AP tests.  North Carolina loves the AP program. In fact, the state pays for the administration of AP tests so that all students in North Carolina have access to a rigorous curriculum. But access, by itself, does not create a pathway to success. Even though North Carolina’s AP pass rate has increased over the past five years to 59.2% in 2022, it is still no better than the national pass rate of 60.2%.

Think about that for a second.

Nationwide, fully 40% of the students who attempt an AP exam fail it, even though–presumably–the students taking the class are prepared for a a college preparatory curriculum.

It’s great that more and more kids have access to rigorous AP courses, and certainly would not want to deny any child who wanted to challenge herself to enroll in a rigorous, college-level AP course. But if she enrolls, don’t we have a responsibility to support that student so she can perform well on the test, too?

Why do so many students fail AP tests?

I work on a pro bono basis for several students at an inner-city high school in Denver. One of my students is ranked second in her class of over 500 students. Academically, she is a stand-out. She is beloved by administrators, teachers, and peers.

She has been singled out as a rare talent in a school with more than its fair share of problems. She is enrolled in AP classes. And she even got to take one during her sophomore year. She received a score of 1 out of 5 on the AP test. How did that happen?

Perhaps students at this school are simply not as bright as the students across town in the wealthy suburbs, where it’s relatively routine for students to score 4 or 5 on the same test. Perhaps this poor girl simply doesn’t have the same preparation, so there is no way she—or any of her peers at this school—could perform on the same level as her peers across the city boundary.

Or is it the teacher? Is it that the teacher of this class in this school does not have the content expertise or the teaching skills to push the students hard enough and far enough to pass the test? How many inner-city high schools are full of talented, passionate teachers like Jaime Escalante, who “stand and deliver” advanced calculus to black and brown students? (Answer: precious few: this is one of those schools in which the overwhelming majority of teachers are in their first year of teaching!)

Or, is this young girl’s failure on the AP test a symptom of something more insidious at work in our educational system? It is simply the culture of low expectations that allows us to offer a course with an AP label, and then neglect to push poorer, browner students in the same way we push their richer, whiter peers?

It’s complicated. But there is no way to escape the disconnect between providing “access” to Advanced Placement and providing the adequate resources to help students pass them. It’s great that North Carolina pays for the administration of the AP tests. But if we want to see pass rates go up, we’d have to examine how North Carolina is creating a system in which the statewide pass rates on AP exams surpass the national average.

How can you find out if Advanced Placement courses are good for college admission at your school?

Putting aside these real issues of educational equity, how can students and their families decide whether an AP course is good for college admission? But for now, I want to focus on what parents can and should be asking about their students’ AP courses.

Essentially, you need to be asking about pass rates. The fact that the AP course is not enough for it to be a “good” course. An AP course in which a high proportion of enrolled students fails the exam is not going to be good for those students when it comes time for college admission. Of course, the rigor of the AP course may be the the best way for the student to access a rigorous curriculum.

Parents should value the availability of AP courses in their schools. But parents should also be digging deeper.

Parents should be asking administrators and teachers some better, tougher questions about those AP courses.

What can I ask my school to learn if Advanced Placement courses are good for college admission?

Basically, you’re trying to find out how well your school supports the AP program and how well it prepares students enrolled in the AP program for success on the nationally-normed examinations.  Here are some questions you might ask of administrators and teachers at your high school.

1. How long has this course been taught in this school?
2. How long has this teacher been teaching this course?
3. Has the teacher received special training to teach this course? If so, what kind of training, and from whom?
4. Are students who take the course required to sit for the AP exam? If not, why not?
5. What percentage of those who take the course attempt the test?
6. What is the teacher’s pass rate? If the teacher taught the course at a different school, what was his or her pass rate there?
7. Of those who passed, how many received a 4 or 5 on the test?
8. Are the teacher’s grades for the course related, in any way, to anticipated performance on the AP test?
9. What sort of assessments does the teacher use in the course? How similar are those assessments to the actual AP tests?
10. How much is writing emphasized in this AP course? (Many of the tests require substantial writing, not just multiple choice questions.)

These sorts of questions will help you better assess the value of a particular AP course at a particular school.

If you find that the answers to these questions are unsatisfactory, there might actually be better options for your college-bound student. Perhaps one of the best is to seek out dual enrollment options at a local college or community college, where your student can take a bona fide college course—at no cost in most states—and be guaranteed of receiving college credit if the student passes the course. (Check out this post for more comparisons between the AP, IB, and dual enrollment options.)

As with most everything else in this world, you cannot judge something merely by its label. The AP brand is generally pretty good. But you’d better look carefully at your school’s ability to help students succeed in those courses before you encourage your student to sign up.

Still wondering if Advanced Placement courses are good for college admission in your particular circumstances?

The decision about whether to take AP courses–how many and which ones–is a big one for many students on the road to college admission. The professional college counselors at Great College Advice help individuals students make these decisions. We help you decide whether AP courses are going to be better for you than other options, like dual enrollment opportunities. We help you decide which AP courses would be best for you to take, and which ones you may not need. We want to help you get into college, and we also want you to take full advantage of all your educational opportunities while in high school. The AP program is a great way to challenge yourself and prepare for college. But as you enroll in those courses, you need to be sure that you have the tools to succeed–not only in the course but on those dreaded exams.  Give us a call or contact us online if you’d like to discuss your personalized plan toward college success.  We’d be happy to chat with you.

Mark Montgomery
Independent College Counseling

The post Are Advanced Placement Courses Good for College Admission first appeared on College Admission Counseling.